What's involved with a basic rewire/organization?

[Hannibal]

Hi all. I am finalizing a list of some needs/wants on my boat and some of these will require the use of hired help.

While not a huge concern of mine at this point, I am interested in doing something with the wiring on the boat. I believe it to be in good working order, however, it is very chaotic and some portions seem to be redundant.

For example, the previous owner had several additional electronic items on the boat that didn't convey so I have switches at the helm that are no longer connected to anything. Also, there are various switches on the switch panel that don't appear to do anything at all. Also, I have two swithes just inside the cuddy for forward pump and rear pump that do nothing. While I would assume they are tied to the bilge pumps - even if the switches are on or off - they have no affect on the actual bilge pumps itself. The rear one works whether this toggle switch is engaged or not. The front one doesn't cut on at all (even manually and needs to be replaced/repaired).

I've also added some things myself (new FF/GPS, VHF radio and overhead lights on the hard top) that are all wired through the control switches. All work just fine, but again, the wiring was done where space allowed (within ratings of course) but not as preferred.

So, while I think I could handle it myself if I had the time, unfortunately time is something I do not have (work is crazy and baby #2 is coming any minute now). What would something like this run if sent somewhere?

I don't think I need to yank all the wires and replace them - but there would have to be some testing to see what switches are no longer needed and some relabeling of others. I'd also like it "tidied" up so future troubleshooting is much easier.

Is this a big expense when outsourced or something a qualified person can do relatively quickly and easily?

 

[DaleH]

I'll start with your last question first ...

Is this a big expense when outsourced or something a qualified person can do relatively quickly and easily?

One ‘re-wire’ quote: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=5600 Around here, I’d say wiring is $60-$80 per hour and a good amount will be spent reviewing what’s there or what needs work (1-3 hours), then drafting/documenting a plan (1+), and then performing the re-wire (?? hours) – so believe me – that’ll add up quickly.

That said, if you understand 12-volt basics and have the tools, and patience to learn good techniques, you can easily do it yourself. PM me, I have a Boat Electrical Wiring 101 DIY article that is in draft form that might help you too. What I try to go into is getting people to understand the term “ampacity”. That is the maximum amount of amps a run can handle, as dependent on (1) the length of the wiring run TO and FROM the power source to the load (most people mess this up and only think the length ‘to’ the device matters, (2) the wire size, and (3) is it a non-critical item, e.g., cabin lights or livewell pump, or a critical item, e.g., VHF, radar, or nav lights.

Typically you don’t want critical items to suffer more than a 3% voltage loss across the run, while all other loads shouldn’t exceed a 10% loss. After that … it’s all technique and parts. Use the best you can, but avoid the ‘box store’ boat chandleries and buy on-line for best pricing, and bulk buys, i.e., adhesive-lined heat shrink in 4’ lengths versus lowly 3” pieces the stores sell you, at a ‘just rape me now’ price.

I also go into some techniques, like mounting breakers in the stern in tupperware 'box' or similar mounted on the inside if the transom … take off the lid, mount the box, mount the switch, cut holes in side of box for the leads, add rubber grommets, attach leads (using dielectric grease), install the lid … and PRESTO … a cheap, foolproof and pretty-much waterproof e-box. But in all honesty, the Wiring 101 paper I have is clearly a ‘draft’ and not fully completed yet. But PM me if you want a copy – or anyone for that matter. All I ask in return is that you send me back feedback – what’s missing, what else would you like to see, or what could be made clearer to understand?

I have switches at the helm that are no longer connected to anything.

Do you have a multimeter? With one, you can diagnose anything within reason.

For using a multimeter, see this post by our very own Seabob4:
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=9415

For a free download of a wiring calculator for 12 volt DC circuits, see this by me:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=350

Also, there are various switches on the switch panel that don't appear to do anything at all.

If a Parker switch panel, there’s be extra switches for different configured models or for factory or dealer options added. One should always allow for ‘overhead’ and expansion when wiring or re-wiring a boat.

I don't think I need to yank all the wires and replace them - but there would have to be some testing to see what switches are no longer needed and some relabeling of others. I'd also like it "tidied" up so future troubleshooting is much easier.

I think you could do this yourself. Congrats on the soon to be addition to the family! But I firmly believe if you do this yourself, you’ll feel better knowing the boat better, if in an emergency. You don’t need to do it all at once, go for the ‘low hanging fruit’ and clean up that which is operational, just needs cleaning up. Then tackle something with more of a challenge, or take it 1 circuit at a time.

FWIW, I use one of those Brother electronic handheld label maker machine and bought the UV or environmental-proof labels they’re still there 8-years later – as good as new! I also use the label machine to mark to the side of the panel, buss bar, or breakers. It will list the item AND the fuse amp rating, like ‘VHF 10’ or ‘GPS 3’. Nothing like having the info right up front for when you need it FAST!

Good luck!

 

[jeffnick]

Think you have a wiring challenge? Take a look at my new to me boat...

This boat is 40 years old and so many electronics have come and gone that it's a real puzzle what's what.

And in light of the marina fire...
http://www2.wnct.com/news/2011/jan/07/1 ... ar-674332/

I feel very fortunate that I didn't suffer a fire consequence because of my eroding shore power connection.

Fortunately for me, the hot wire just burned itself into two -- without causing a fire.

Might want to check yours.

 

[sparky]

I'll recommend GenuineDealz (http://genuinedealz.com/) for all your connector, heatshrink, and wire needs. Amazing prices, and top-notch products.

 

[DaleH]

I'll recommend GenuineDealz (http://genuinedealz.com/) for all your connector, heatshrink, and wire needs. Amazing prices, and top-notch products.

Ditto - GREAT source!

 

[Hannibal]

Dale - thank you for the information and I would definately love to see the draft write up you have. Even if not complete, any information would certainly help improve my knowledge base at this point.

I've done basic wiring (more so with electronics on a kayak of all things) and some minor connections on this boat so I have a general feel for what is there and needed. Fortunately, being that my boat is a basic 21' with not a whole lot of bells and whistles - the wiring seems to be minimal and fairly direct.

If I did it myself, I would first look to swap out the switch board and the bus bar(s) - if I am using the right term - for new/upgraded versions. I'd have to think that what is there is original equipment (1991 boat) so I'd think I'd definately improve things with some newer peices.

From there, I'd think I'd simply disconnect the wires from the old units and reconnect to the new ones in a 1 to 1 exchange. IE - simply make a switch over.

From there, I'd think I'd address it one circuit/item at a time. In other words, I'd review the lines from the batteries to the bus bars (standard two battery setup) to make sure the connections are solid and in good shape. I BELIEVE (simply based on a quick glance) that this portion is OK. I believe it was upgraded during the repower (previous owner installed a 2003 Evinrude 225). The batteries and the heavier guage +/- leads seems to be in good shape as do their connection ends.

So assuming those are good to go, I would envision tackling individual circuits and attempting to organize critical/non-critical items. I don't have anything on board that should be a huge draw (I have basic stuff - VHF, Fish/Depth finder, occasionally use a portable Ipod dock off the 12-volt accessory port). And beyond that, it's standard stuff like the engine electronics, deck lights, overhead lights on the hard top, nav. lighting and bilge pumps).

I don't have any plans or any real need to expand beyond that (I just don't have the room to get too fancy or start adding livewells, etc). So, I would THINK (pending review of draws) that I could run critical items via one bus and non-critical via the other with room for minor expansion (again, if I am using the terms correctly). I can see it in my head but just might not be conveying it correctly.

I would look to address individual items/runs as time allowed. For example, go through the wiring for the VHF system - checking wire conditions (should be good as that was just recently installed), upgrade connections/seals, etc - and make sure it is routed correctly and tied to the switch panel as I want it (and labled accordingly). Once I am satisfied, go through the next run (such as the nav. lights) ....... rinse and repeat.

I could probably learn the correct terms and fill in some blanks with your draft and additional reading. Just trying to sort somethings out in my head.

I'd also like to look at hardwiring my bilge pumps to the battery so there is power constantly available to it even if the boat is "off". At least on the pump towards the stern as that is where water would pool when the boat is on the trailer and not in use.

 

[Megabyte]

Direct connecting your bilge pumps is a good way to begin.

Some folks who trailer sometimes route the power through the master switch, but it really isn't needed so long as you don't have one of those 'auto sensing' pumps that cycle to determine if water is present.
Take a look at the pumps and first decide if they are the correct size, then look at replacing any old float switches with the newer electronic type.
I use the Water Witch 101 electronic switches in my boat, and I've found them to be very reliable.
http://www.waterwitchinc.com/new/SiteEl ... ducts.html

I don't own a multimeter, but I do have a number of automotive test lights that I use to test circuits. So far, that has worked well for me.
The test lights (and a 12vdc buzzer) allowed me to identify circuits and abandoned wiring from the previous owner.

At some point, the wiring harnesses that parker installs in their boats were upgraded to allow for all of the electrical options available in a particular model.
Depending on the year of your boat, you may find wiring that appears abandoned, but actually isn't.

For example, a raw water washdown is an option on just about every model, but even if your boat did not come with a washdown pump, the wiring for one might already be in place and wired to a helm switch.
So before you begin removing any suspected 'abandoned' wiring, you might want to determine if those wires are actually for an option that you do not presently have.

I do not know what year the factory began installing wiring harnesses of this type, but a call to the factory with your HIN would tell you pretty quickly.

Hope this helps!

 

[sparky]

No matter what, I'd spend the $25 and get a decent digital multimeter. I've got several units, from a cheap-o Harbor Freight analog unit to a very expensive RMS Fluke. I'd recommend something in the mid range, around $20-$40. Any more, and you'll get functions that you don't need, and less and it'll be a POS that'll die when you need it.

http://www.craftsman.com/shc/s/p_10155_ ... ockType=L1
That was my first unit (bought about 15 years ago, when I was 13), and its still kicking. Very reliable, and cheap to boot, plus its available locally. Just pick up some extra fuses for its amperage settings, and it takes a 9v battery.

 

[Megabyte]

No matter what, I'd spend the $25 and get a decent digital multimeter. I've got several units, from a cheap-o Harbor Freight analog unit to a very expensive RMS Fluke. I'd recommend something in the mid range, around $20-$40. Any more, and you'll get functions that you don't need, and less and it'll be a POS that'll die when you need it.

http://www.craftsman.com/shc/s/p_10155_ ... ockType=L1
That was my first unit (bought about 15 years ago, when I was 13), and its still kicking. Very reliable, and cheap to boot, plus its available locally. Just pick up some extra fuses for its amperage settings, and it takes a 9v battery.

I like that Craftsman multimeter.
I need to pick one up the next time I'm in Sears!
Thanks!

 

[jeffnick]

I'm decimally challenged. I got an autoranging model at Walmart. It has an auto off feature if you forget to turn it off.

 

[Fireman]

Capt. Kevin,

Do you have any pictures of where your Water Witch 101 switch is mounted?

I'd like to see how it's organized in your bilge.

 

[Megabyte]

Do you have any pictures of where your Water Witch 101 switch is mounted?
I'd like to see how it's organized in your bilge.

Here you go...
The WW101 attaches under the discharge hose clamp, and is adjusted by rotating it.

 

[Fireman]

Thanks for posting the pic. While disconnecting my batteries today so that I could pump out my fuel tank, I couldn't help but sit for a few minutes and look at my bilge and think about how clean it could look. Hopefully soon. Looking at the pics of your boat and the others on here gets my mind running in many different directions as to the projects I want to complete.

Hopefully we'll be hanging the new Yamaha F250 within the next couple of weeks. Let the projects of 2011 begin!

 

[FishPimp]

Those water witches are the bomb and have no moving parts to get rusted out, fouled and then fail.
I have those on the FishPimp